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2010-11-22 Home Front: WoT
TSA chief: "Not going to change"
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Posted by Fred 2010-11-22 00:00|| E-Mail|| Front Page|| [11134 views ]  Top

#1 Good. Where can I send the thank you card?

Sensitive people who don't want their breasts or junk or colostomy bag touched form a queue over to the right. Yall get your own plane along with Achmed the male terrorist disguised as a female in a burkha. Fly the friendly skies together. Buh bye now.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 00:21||   2010-11-22 00:21|| Front Page Top

#2 If I can take my gun I'm fine with that
Posted by European Conservative 2010-11-22 00:26||   2010-11-22 00:26|| Front Page Top

#3 Lawmakers, however, appear to be hearing from constituents about this, and they tend to be more reactive to public pressure.

Finally they grew a brain. I wonder how long this will last.

I don't mind some level of checks, but this last round has gone beyond the ridiculous into just another Constitutional assault. One of many.
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 00:42||   2010-11-22 00:42|| Front Page Top

#4 reactive

Yea, reactive= rash brash action most of the time. So that sounds about right. Proactive is what is lacking in our air travel security and has been lacking since the 70's. We've had plenty of time to self correct. Knuckleheads who still treasure their boob and scrotal sanctity or burkha sanctity, form a line to the right. Call us who want our junk touched and to arrive arrive alive pervs or Nazis, we don't mind.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 00:50||   2010-11-22 00:50|| Front Page Top

#5 Good. Where can I send the thank you card?

Here:
TSA Contact Form My contact information submitted was rather creative. My comment to the point.
Posted by Spavick Lumumba2929 2010-11-22 00:51||   2010-11-22 00:51|| Front Page Top

#6 
Your new government at work. Using parents as unwitting accomplices to help indoctrinate the next generation into being properly submissive.

I wonder what new level of submission they have planned for their children when they are 20-30 years older.

All in the name of potential terrorist attacks that have not been launched from American soil since 9/11.

Profiling would work fine.



Nice.
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 00:56||   2010-11-22 00:56|| Front Page Top

#7 Profiling would work fine.

Devils in the details. Can I have that in writing that profiling would work fine? Can my family be remunerated in the event of my death due to profiling negligence by TSA, Napolitano and the Gummint? Pre-flight can I be given an actuarial chart with an accurate airline passenger mortality rate due to bombers and hostage situations on it? The answer is no, right? Because that is not a question they want answered.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 01:08||   2010-11-22 01:08|| Front Page Top

#8 Profiling might at least work better than fondling the private parts of a 6yo boy just to show how pc you are.

It's no solution. If you start profiling at the gate, it's way too late.
Posted by European Conservative 2010-11-22 01:24||   2010-11-22 01:24|| Front Page Top

#9 In the 20th century, the kids used to play "Doctor".

Now they play "TSA Agent".
Posted by KBK 2010-11-22 01:25||   2010-11-22 01:25|| Front Page Top

#10 Emotional ploys to distract from the real issue, which is how much of a threat terrorists pose, and what religion is behind the threat? And given that nobody want to say aloud that it is primarily that religion, we have to go through all of this and are all endangered. Suck it up, people, or fight the root cause which is Islam and quit the bitching and moaning.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 01:33||   2010-11-22 01:33|| Front Page Top

#11 WEST PALM BEACH, Fla. -- Deputies may detain Palm Beach International Airport travelers who refuse to submit to a full-body scanner or a pat down, the Palm Beach County Sheriff's Office confirmed Friday.
Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2010-11-22 01:50||   2010-11-22 01:50|| Front Page Top

#12 It looks like Private Eye is a big theater fan. Security theater, that is. Of the absurd.

Private Eye: "Let's all celebrate the TSA doing nothing to enhance safety, in the most humiliating manner possible. Yay!"
Posted by Scooter McGruder 2010-11-22 03:11||   2010-11-22 03:11|| Front Page Top

#13 All this latest crap is utterly pointless in my opinion. We have bigger security holes to worry about than whether or not someone's wife has a ring in her genitalia. I had my reservations but was tolerating the TSA before the "enhanced" measures were released on the flying masses.

Can I have that in writing that profiling would work fine?

Yeah. Right after I get in writing that grope-downs and porno-scans work fine against some muslim airline employee plants a bomb in the planes cargo hold or in a seat cushion for someone else to use. Or that some terrorist doesn't shoot an RPG through a plane as it takes off or lands. And that foreign countries will do their job and have equally "good" security at their end of the deal (yes, flights both to and from Yemen contain the same number of Americans).

Right after I get that letter precluding the possibility of a terrorist who smuggling a pound of RDX up his bum into an airplane. Or the possibility of his terrorist brother having two kilos of C4 surgically implanted next to his "artificial hip".

Right after I get that other letter promising that terrorist won't decides it's time to start leaving bombs under the seat on NY buses because TSA security is so wonderfully perfect.

As for profiling, yeah I think we should continue to grope six year old boys and girls, little old ladies in wheelchairs, and men with colostomy bags. /sarc

Profiling does not start at the gate. That is a misconception. It starts when you buy your ticket. You are intercepted when you pick it up if your profile raises flags.

El Al management laughs at US "security" measures. Of course, they try to be diplomatic about it, but it's still the same in the end. I've flown out of Ben Gurion by the way. Their way is better and quicker. I even got into one of the profiling "chats" with a good looking Israeli security agent during a lull while some other trainees(?) were looking on, probably learning the business. Then again, if they had my profile, then maybe they were there to keep me from hitting on her too much.

Whoops, now that I think about it for 10 seconds, colostomy bags can contain more than three ounces of some highly explosive liquid should some terrorist decide to go that direction. So much for getting that letter for the scanners and grope-downs, too.

Can my family be remunerated in the event of my death due to profiling negligence by TSA

Just as much as they would be if TSA missed something with a naked scanner or one of their grope-downs.

how much of a threat terrorists pose

Not as much as Chertoff would have us believe as he rakes in tons of cash off this sweetheart deal of his. Another sure sign that something is amiss if they have to pay him off to get this to happen.

If you have 1 million people standing in line for an hour, that's a million hour off people's lives. That's 114 years of life wasted. Plus all the other time spent dealing with this, that, or the other problem such as acquiring one-quart plastic baggies and three ounce bottles and leaving something at home that you have to take the time to pick up at the other end of your trip because the TSA won't allow it. All of a sudden four or probably more lives worth of time have passed by in the name of zero risk. On top of that we have about 60,000 TSA agents working 8 hours a day. That's another 600,000 hours a day for you right there. Many won't live 600,000 hours. That's another 365 lives lost right there each year. Even looking at it unemotionally, the math says it's not worth the effort invested and the life wasted dealing with over-aggressive security. Did I mention that these numbers assume you never sleep?

There is no such thing as a perfect product. Any entity that tries to attain such a lofty goal will go bankrupt.

This is just one more opening for totalitarian rules to get a better foothold in a land supposedly ruled by the Constitution. The resulting call to those who will take advantage of the new rules for personal gain at the expense of the peasants. The resulting expansion on these rules.

If the government doesn't like you because you are a hacker, the TSA will intercept you and confiscate any electronics you have. And return them after a few hours. And send you on your way. How comforting to know. This has been happening already. Someone please remind me what the acronym TSA stand for?

Unreasonable searches and invasions of privacy. Humiliations. Guilty until proven innocent. Government regulation of what should be a way more private endeavor. Possessions confiscated and tampered with (in the name of what, exactly?). The function of government agencies subverted. The Constitution trampled.

I don't want zero risk if this is what it costs me.

What couldn't they make you do in the name of zero risk?

What mode of transportation, communication, or purchasing goods or services couldn't they compromise? And if they didn't like something they saw, why couldn't they hijack the TSA or any other apparatus to come scrutinize you, all in the name of zero risk for "the children" or whatever?

Yes I'm emotional, in a logical sort of way. The terrorists will win if we keep diddling with this crap by dabbling with totalitarianism instead of addressing the root of the problem.

If this country were run by folks who applied just a bit of commons sense and didn't fear political forces that should never have existed in the first place, if folks would not think the Constitution was a suicide pact when our enemies were using it against us, then we would never have gotten to the point where everyone has to suffer instead of just the tiny minority group that refuses to deal with the problem that is inseparably woven into their religion.

This is quite the "crisis" we have manufactured, isn't it?
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 03:33||   2010-11-22 03:33|| Front Page Top

#14 For those who support the TSA and its stormtrooper tactics, remember one thing : The Nuremberg Trials conclusively demonstrated that "I was only following orders" would still get your monkey ass hanged, if it was an illegal order. Fondling 3-6 years olds is an illegal order, and any TSA thug that follows that order should be liable for a Nuremberg Necktie.
Posted by Shieldwolf 2010-11-22 03:41||   2010-11-22 03:41|| Front Page Top

#15 gorb
Great rant!
Posted by European Conservative 2010-11-22 03:57||   2010-11-22 03:57|| Front Page Top

#16 This is quite the "crisis" we have manufactured, isn't it? Posted by gorb
Posted by Besoeker 2010-11-22 06:18||   2010-11-22 06:18|| Front Page Top

#17 This is quite the "crisis" we have manufactured, isn't it? Posted by gorb

It certainly is Gorb and thanks for your excellent comments.

This stuff started when Pan Am 103 went down and we've done virtually nothing since, other than have our president encourage the release of one of the key bomb planners under the false pretence of terminal illness. Libya should have been destroyed in an atomic fireball! Any state that sponsors these acts should be atomic fireballed, including the one where 17 of the 9/11 terrorists came from!
Posted by Besoeker 2010-11-22 06:25||   2010-11-22 06:25|| Front Page Top

#18 By the way. All terrorism is STATE SPONSORED! (just my opinion mind you)

Everyone in the world, all intelligence services, know who these people are. Not taking action against them, not executing them or deporting them back to their slime hole countries of origin is tantamount to complicity. Domestic, US born terrorists are NO exception! Our own gov't is complicit. Allowing muslims to be employed as contract employee airport gate and security line guides at Dulles is but one example.
Posted by Besoeker 2010-11-22 06:46||   2010-11-22 06:46|| Front Page Top

#19 Private Eye, I bet I've flown many more miles than you have, or probably ever will. In all that time, somehow me, my family members, my friends, acquaintances, frenemies, and random strangers have all managed to make it to our destinations safely without having to get bombarded by possibly high levels of radiation (not my words for it....Johns Hopkins'), or get a grope without a courtesy "happy ending".

I know, what's my solution, right? Fair enough, I have one for your perusal.....like, get this, if someone's dad, who happens to be a government official in Nigeria, tells our people that his son is a wackaloon and we shouldn't let him in....and he shows up for a flight without a passport or warm clothes suitable for Michigan in December.....maybe we SHOULDN'T LET HIM ON THE FREAKIN' PLANE! Because then we wouldn't have to hope that a big ol' "Flying Dutchman" is standing by ready to tackle the numbnutz and save the day.

But hey, maybe you like getting a more thorough pat-down than a cop would give you during an arrest. (Yep, did those for male officers back in the day. I wasn't allowed to get up in someone's junk, squeeze their hooters, or really REALLY give that guilty lookin' 3 year old the bizness like TSA agents can and will do. I could only go underneath clothing if I felt something suspicious, not because I always wanted to see what a colostomy bag looked like and thought that the rest of the people milling about might like to see one, too. Think about that for a moment.)

Just help me out here a bit. I have a four year old boy, who is squirmy during the best of times. How do you suggest that I tell him that "no one can touch him there, not without his permission, unless it's some barely edumacated rentacop with authority issues because we need to get on the plane, and if he causes any trouble, we could all get arrested..."? 'Cause, see, I haven't figured out how to do that yet.

Maybe if you could come over and tell him that seeing him get fondled by someone with a badge makes you feel all warm and secure and happy that would help....'cause that 4th Amendment crap is only for dirty hippies and other clowns who think the Constitution is important.....
Posted by Swamp Blondie 2010-11-22 07:22||   2010-11-22 07:22|| Front Page Top

#20 The problem I see is that the current process simply won't work. IT DOESN'T WORK. When it fails, and a lot of people get killed [again] there will be even more restrictions, cavity searches, perhaps even traveling in hospital gowns.

It does appear that the object of the current process is not to increase safety - but to get people used to being grope-searched on a regular basis.

What they need to do is profiling - as people mentioned starting at the purchase of the ticket - if not before.

Not necessarily racial profiling - because the wackjobs can be of practically any race.

And yes *religious* profiling. One's religion is a choice and should not be protected from scrutiny.

Hasn't Israel been using such techniques for a few decades now? Very effectively I might add.

And Gorb - that is an excellent rant.
Posted by CrazyFool 2010-11-22 08:44||   2010-11-22 08:44|| Front Page Top

#21 You all are funny. All the theater seems to be right here regarding getting frisked, the fourth amendment, time in queues, etc.
Let me ask you a question: does it make you happy to sensationalize a frisk? Really? Sad. Being patted down is for those who don't want to be scanned. Let me guess, the radiation is too much. Wrong --it's less than dental work. Or ooooooh Idont want them to see backscatter. Let me field that one for you: Youre not all that so nobody but you cares. Or the rare individual at TSA who sees the butt plug you're wearing up you ass and talks about you later.
Because what you're telling me is that you'd let a terrorist into your house. We have terrorists in our house people. And our house needs to be put in order... The only theatre is the chorus of whines. And the profiling does begin before you get to the gate...and that's a continually improving mechanism. The stuff at the AP is to keep all the amateur would be terrorists dissuaded. It's called deterrant for the small time would be trouble makers.
Posted by PrivateEye 2010-11-22 08:44||   2010-11-22 08:44|| Front Page Top

#22 And my parting antic for the day is for Swamp Blondie of which I am sure to get a reaction on is this

If you've traveled so much it surely must be domestically. Because any world traveler goes through many security check point nightmares according to the attendant host nations laws. And I am know for sure some of those make ours look lax. And Lastly, did you whine and complain overseas?
Posted by PrivateEye 2010-11-22 09:02||   2010-11-22 09:02|| Front Page Top

#23 #/tinfoil hat

All this enhanced security is not just for the tangos, it is from a burocratic wish list to catch ANYTHING on the proscribed list. National check points, looking for drugs, escaped felons, etc. Clever, realy. If you are a pathological control freak.

Wonder when they will set up a similar set of checkpoints on the interstate? think ryder truck in okc and imagine what happens then.

Thank you so ver much, you (2 minutes of expletives deleted)statists.

tinfoil hat/#
Posted by nGuard 2010-11-22 09:12||   2010-11-22 09:12|| Front Page Top

#24 And lastly I am not convinced that Super smart Israeli style questioning would work in the United States. We are not Israel. We don't have the discipline. instead we have a nation of unruly child-adults who can't decide what they want. Were not Israel. And I don't see BenGurion Airport around here.
Posted by PrivateEye 2010-11-22 09:13||   2010-11-22 09:13|| Front Page Top

#25 When? Actually a certain state (name withheld) has had road block check points on any old road in full swing since at least the eighties:-(
Posted by PrivateEye 2010-11-22 09:22||   2010-11-22 09:22|| Front Page Top

#26 ..nation of unruly child-adults who can't decide what they want..

I'm sure Lord North has the same type of opinion of the rustic provincials on the other side of the Atlantic.
Posted by Procopius2k 2010-11-22 09:25||   2010-11-22 09:25|| Front Page Top

#27 Private Eye, that's the first time I recall seeing "Lastly" at the beginning of two posts in the same thread. Bravo. Anyway, I'm feeling generous and will grant your wish in #22.

Shocking though it may be to you, but I have traveled internationally. To more than one continent, even. That being said....I didn't have to get felt up in the old Soviet Union when I traveled there. I didn't get felt up in ANY other country.

I did, however, get asked personal questions, which I answered, and I did get my bags rifled through and sniffed by dogs. I guess somehow I matched a "profile". I didn't get my panties in a wad over it, either. This "child-adult"/drama queen handled it just fine, thank you very much, just like the majority of Americans would.

Now, princess with all the answers....can you come up with a good reason for a kid to get molested to get on a plane, or not? Because your need for kabuki theater to quiet all those big, bad, scary voices in your head isn't enough for me to allow some mook to feel up my kid.

It wouldn't have caught Richard Reid, it wouldn't have caught the Fruit of the Boom bomber, it wouldn't have caught the Butt Bomber who tried to off a Saudi prince and it won't catch the next one.

I am sure that when that happens, you will be the first in line at the airport for your anal probe and pap smear, followed by donning a hospital gown throughout your flight, right? Because you are doing it to be Secure (TM).
Posted by Swamp Blondie 2010-11-22 09:49||   2010-11-22 09:49|| Front Page Top

#28 Well the provincials in this country are accustomed to coddling. Were used to if we scream and protest and pound our little fists on the ground, we will get our way. And largely that is how it works here. After 9-11 we huffed and stomped. Now we're huffing about the fourth amendment. But I guarantee if a plane gets blown to bits at Christmas this year, all the little petulant children will gladly go along with TSA for a few nanoseconds till they grow tired of that game and go in search of a new tantrum to have.

Now, can you stop interrupting me? I have to get back to wearing my pajamas out in public.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 09:54||   2010-11-22 09:54|| Front Page Top

#29 every rant on this should be precessed with a acknowledgment that the only reason this is a problem is because of one religion
Posted by Lord Garth 2010-11-22 10:00||   2010-11-22 10:00|| Front Page Top

#30 Lots of good rants here, keep the personal attacks out. What is frustrating is we seem to be more willing to play a reacitve security game like wack mole, than do the hard reality and go after these idiots. We need to profile, we need to give the muslim community a hard time. We need to raid their mosques and tap their phones. We need to go to the places that support the terrorists, both active and passive. They need to know that they are part of the problem or part of the solution.
Posted by 49 Pan 2010-11-22 10:01||   2010-11-22 10:01|| Front Page Top

#31 Insulting people who don't agree with you? Check.

Comparing Americans to spoiled children when they don't go along quietly with Captain Wonderful's regime? Check.

Willing to shred the Constitution when it is inconvenient? Check.

Gratuitous slam on Israel? Check.

Worried about nameless "big bad monsters" that we're all gonna be sorry about when they attack? Check.

Demand for absolute safety 100% of the time? Check.

Folks, I do believe we have a "Hopium" addict among us!!

Posted by Swamp Blondie 2010-11-22 10:02||   2010-11-22 10:02|| Front Page Top

#32 Swamp Blondie. Do you even bother to read other's posts?

I said that the U.S. doesn't seem to have the discipline to do what it takes to conduct a dependable version of an Israeli style questioning system. And being that I am of Jewish heritage, Israel has my respect.


Again, all this "kabuki" could be avoided if a profiling system was put in place that acknowledges the Muslims are at the root of our terrorist problems, separates it out and adresses it in a way that shifts the owness from the general public. But that would involve acknowledging the Muslim problem more overtly at all levels of society. Agree with Lord Garth on that.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 10:16||   2010-11-22 10:16|| Front Page Top

#33 From the administration which takes Arizona to court for simply asking a question during a routine traffic stops. Ask yourself how many Americans have been killed in America since 9/10 by a)terrorist and b)illegals.

Security? Really?
Posted by Procopius2k 2010-11-22 10:21||   2010-11-22 10:21|| Front Page Top

#34 I still haven't seen anybody rebut my points on anything other than an emotional level.
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 10:34||   2010-11-22 10:34|| Front Page Top

#35 Here's one, private eyeball: Put your clothes back on so we can search you:

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local-beat/Passenger-Chooses-Strip-Down-Over-Pat-Down-109872589.html?dr
Posted by Muggsy Glink 2010-11-22 10:59||   2010-11-22 10:59|| Front Page Top

#36 Here's another one:

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/130243-analyst-new-tsa-procedures-will-kill-more-americans-on-the-highway
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 11:17||   2010-11-22 11:17|| Front Page Top

#37 Ummm Hmmmmmmmm.


So when does the crack down on Muslim extremists and their supporters begin? And by filling the papers and news of the average person with this unfortunate stuff we're fixing the Mooselimb problem?
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 11:25||   2010-11-22 11:25|| Front Page Top

#38 gorb, interesting article (the first one). I gotta remember to get a matching set at Frederick's the next time I fly.
Posted by Swamp Blondie 2010-11-22 11:34||   2010-11-22 11:34|| Front Page Top

#39 Sorry, but after gorb's article posting, I just couldn't resist.....



Posted by Swamp Blondie 2010-11-22 11:37||   2010-11-22 11:37|| Front Page Top

#40  SB, hater of theatre, you sure seem to do a lot of dramatic interpretations of a pat down while avoiding directly debating the humongous Muslim problem.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 11:39||   2010-11-22 11:39|| Front Page Top

#41 Swampy, I don't particularly mind you giving gorb credit for the 'put your clothes on so we can search you'article, it's my fault for not knowing how to highlight it for click and go. However, if you could post a few previews of your Fredericks traveling attire, it would be appreciated. :)
Posted by Muggsy Glink 2010-11-22 11:49||   2010-11-22 11:49|| Front Page Top

#42 Mr. eye, Leon Minetta didn't 'see' a problem with the 7th Century seethers. That would be so judgemental.
Posted by Muggsy Glink 2010-11-22 11:56||   2010-11-22 11:56|| Front Page Top

#43 Private Eye, I didn't realize you wanted to "debate", since each and every question I brought up (as in why a child needs to get groped in public to make you feel safer) gets blown off, or I get accused of not being able to comprehend what was written, etc.

In case you didn't notice, I was addressing gorb. You are not gorb. I was employing a thing called "ridicule", which I tend to do when some really idiotic or outrageous governmental action takes place. Y'know, 1st amendment rights.....just north of the 4th amendment right to be free of unreasonable search and seizure? Yeah, THAT one.

But to make it painfully obvious.....I mentioned that overseas I dealt with security measures that have been offered as an alternative to the scans and pat downs in other countries (see post #27). Even when I was on the receiving end of special attention like that, I didn't have a problem with it, and didn't think other Americans would.

Does that make my position clear, or do you need further clarification with an orange crayon drawing?
Posted by Swamp Blondie 2010-11-22 12:00||   2010-11-22 12:00|| Front Page Top

#44 TSA can grope my body for One hundred dollars. Or a few shots of Grey Goose. Im sure many women have given a grope away for less. Let me pose in my touch my sexy ass and bra gear for the occasion the next time I fly. TSA's day just got SOOO much better. Now, can we get back to debating why the malarkey that passes for legislation as it applies to terrorists has holes in it so big that you could park a plane there.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 12:00||   2010-11-22 12:00|| Front Page Top

#45 Muggsy, you naughty scamp!! Off to your room! ;)
Posted by Swamp Blondie 2010-11-22 12:01||   2010-11-22 12:01|| Front Page Top

#46 Are ya done flirting darling? Alright then.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 12:06||   2010-11-22 12:06|| Front Page Top

#47 Private Eye,

I am assuming you are this article by Ann Coulter is your main argument?. If the link does not work, her article is at www.AnnCoulter.com .
Posted by wr 2010-11-22 12:06||   2010-11-22 12:06|| Front Page Top

#48 Not on your life, PE dear. Deal with it.
Posted by Swamp Blondie 2010-11-22 12:17||   2010-11-22 12:17|| Front Page Top

#49 Private Eye:

Here's where you started:

Good. Where can I send the thank you card?

Sensitive people who don't want their breasts or junk or colostomy bag touched form a queue over to the right. Yall get your own plane along with Achmed the male terrorist disguised as a female in a burkha. Fly the friendly skies together. Buh bye now.


Here's where you were last seen:

Now, can we get back to debating why the malarkey that passes for legislation as it applies to terrorists has holes in it so big that you could park a plane there.


Of course, there's going to be some confusion given that most people here like to work with stationary targets.

So if you last statement is your position, then yes, the legislation is based in a lot of broken assumptions, ignorance, wishful thinking, theater and ulterior motives.
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 12:24||   2010-11-22 12:24|| Front Page Top

#50 And spoil all the fun? Well well well. Methinks that my original argument about sums up where we're at as Americans. If you don't mind being groped, form one line. If you do mind, form another line. Separate the lines. Give each what they want and a plane to fly in with like minded individuals. A plane according to their specifications. We'll see at the end of five years which planes got blown up. Or which didnt. Repeat experiment.
Or as Ann Coulter does presciently say,
"You have to search for the terrorists." That may include looking at things we don't want to.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 12:26||   2010-11-22 12:26|| Front Page Top

#51 I don't see how you get from your intial statement to your final statement. Neither does anyone else.

If this is how your rhetoric and logic flow, then you're going to be ignored or used as a chew toy until you correct it.

It's not an enviable position.
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 12:45||   2010-11-22 12:45|| Front Page Top

#52 Umm, Gorb, I am going to push in tighter on what you just said. Are you a Mod? If and when I become a chew toy, I can deal.

Re- paraphrasing? Pro pat downs and against pats downs both have a right to exist and have their needs met. Give each choices in how they travel. All Im trying to say here is that. It could also be argued that you thought intimidation is debate by your chew toy comment.

Segregation of for vs. against streamlines a solution. Now why do you think some people don't mind being patted down, in your opinion? Answer me that simple question to clarify your position.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 12:57||   2010-11-22 12:57|| Front Page Top

#53 How long will it be before everyone has to fly nekkid? This whole business is absurd. Pilots aren't allowed to carry nail clippers or liquids and have to go through the same searches as everyone else but are allowed at the controls of a flying bomb.
Posted by Deacon Blues 2010-11-22 13:00||   2010-11-22 13:00|| Front Page Top

#54 Are you a Mod?

Should it matter?

And all I am saying is that your initial comment set the pace, and that there is no connection between your initial comment and your stance now. If you have something to say, please just say it in a way that doesn't require a decoder ring or people will think of and treat you as a troll.

If you ask me, I'm of the opinion that you started out siding with the TSA, and then tried to move the goalposts when you thought about it a bit. Maybe I'm wrong. It would help if your initial statement would have been written more clearly if this is the case. It would have helped if your many follow-up comments would have indicated this, too, rather than just trying to irritate folks like a troll would.
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 13:08||   2010-11-22 13:08|| Front Page Top

#55 I do not think I could be any more clear. Separate those who want to be frisked and scanned and those who don't out. And send them on their merry ways. On separate planes. That was my original comment, and it hasn't changed.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 13:14||   2010-11-22 13:14|| Front Page Top

#56 Private Eye: I am a mod.

Suggestion: dial it down one notch. You're arguing with a cadre of regulars here. I know them. I don't know you. We are about vigorous but civil discourse. If you can't do that you won't do well here.

Now then.

Do not expect people to respond well (here on the Burg or elsewhere in America) if you refer to the great majority of American citizens to be child-adults and provincials.

You see, most of us are heart-landers, and we resent overly-credentialed types calling us names. I don't know how credentialed you are (I have a few but those credentials don't make me an expert on anything, and so I don't brag about what papers I have on a wall, here or anywhere else), but talking down to us isn't going to work.

Most of the people here have education and life-experiences that give them a fair idea of how the world works. Some here are ex-military. Many have been educated in the school of hard knocks, though one generally doesn't get credentials for that.

Point is: there is a lot of collective expertise here, even if few of us have read Ulysses all the way through.

I will respond specifically to your points in my next comment.


AoS (Army of Steve)
Posted by Steve White 2010-11-22 13:23||   2010-11-22 13:23|| Front Page Top

#57 I do not think I could be any more clear.

You're crystal clear now.

And your initial comment was crystal clear that you thought folks who were against the naked scanner and grope-downs were overly sensitive, should get their own separate system to fly in, would all end up dead, and that you would stand in the line run by the TSA. Whether you recognized it at the time or not, that put you on the side of a totalitarian government if that is what it took so you would have a tiny bit safer flight.

He (or she) who would trade liberty for some temporary security, deserves neither liberty nor security.
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 13:25||   2010-11-22 13:25|| Front Page Top

#58 Private Eye, your positions are two "lines": 1) No security at all or 2). Full blown lewd groping of passengers by Federal Officials in public, which is your preferred position. No middle ground. Correct??
Posted by wr 2010-11-22 13:28||   2010-11-22 13:28|| Front Page Top

#59 So, do you want to look good for Rantburgers or Gorb? Intimidation and issuing put down is typical gang behavior, especially against outsiders. And being hassled by Ms. Swamp Blondie did nothing to speed along any useful debate.

As for Americans, I am one. And I do not retract the statement about child-adults. Our country is chronologically a baby and acts like one in fits and starts it periodically undergoes. I would think reading literature like Ulysses would indicate circumspection about one's own nation is not off the menu.

Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 13:31||   2010-11-22 13:31|| Front Page Top

#60 To replace foreign aid, I suggest donating the $4B paid for the zappers to foreign airports that have planes flying to the US. Require them to use them. As to the false flag of get groped or don't gripe, the new normal isn't.
Posted by Muggsy Glink 2010-11-22 13:32||   2010-11-22 13:32|| Front Page Top

#61 And I never said those in the anti TSA plane would die. You put words in my mouth. Is that your science talking now?
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 13:37||   2010-11-22 13:37|| Front Page Top

#62 A more specific response to Private Eye, having first laid down the ground rules.

1) America is not Israel. That does not mean that we can't learn from Israel, and other countries, on proper security measures. I've travelled throughout Europe by plane and train. I've seen certain aspects of how they handle security. Not all of that would work in the U.S., but they have interesting ideas. Israel has a different perspective on security. They and we also have a common enemy. We'd do well to pay attention to how they implement their security.

2) No one likes to be groped. Repeat: no one likes to be groped. Whether it's in the name of 'national security' or in any other situation, people have boundaries and expect other humans to respect those boundaries. That the TSA is requiring their workers to violate those boundaries, in public, in the open, upsets many. That is is done in the name of 'national security' generates not just outrage but also suspicion. The latter is fundamentally dangerous in a society where governance rests on the consent of the governed. We'd do well to reject policies that make our people suspicious of our government.

3) Americans, be they heartlanders or coastal-'elites', tend to be fussy about their rights, particularly those enumerated in the Bill of Rights. We appreciate the 4th amendment, for example, which is supposed to bar the government from engaging in unreasonable search and seizures. There are plenty of Americans who think that being groped in an airport security line is an unreasonable search. They hear the stories about the young boy being strip searched, the man with the ileostomy bag who had his own urine spilled all over him by the TSA agent, and the various stories of very personal pat-downs, and they say, "wait a minute, that's unreasonable!"

Americans do not want terrorists on their airplanes (of course). If we thought that the pat-downs would stop that, perhaps (just perhaps) we'd put up with the new security measures. But we aren't convinced that the TSA (and the rest of the government by extension) knows what it is doing. We're not convinced that there is a core competency that is running the show. We've seen the breakdowns and stupidities, and we've listened to government officials (e.g., Napolitano) who aren't exactly inspiring us with confidence.

With that in mind, Americans are becoming convinced that the current pat-downs are unreasonable. You might disagree, but the ball is in your court.

4) Americans don't like the new full body scans. It's becoming clear that the scanners were purchased at the behest of lobbyists representing the vendors and not necessarily because the scanners represented the best technology to stop terrorists. As you may have noticed, a fair number of Americans (e.g., the Tea Party) are really, really PISSED right now about insider deals in government.

Americans have heard that the scanners put out more radiation then claimed. There is (perhaps) some factual basis for that concern.

Americans have heard that the images from the scanners have been stored and displayed to others when they weren't supposed to be.

With that in mind, Americans are becoming convinced that the full-body scanners are unreasonable. Again, it's your job to convince us otherwise.

5) While Americans (correctly, IMO) reject profiling based on race, ethnicity, gender and religion, they have no problem at all with profiling based on behavior. There are terrorists in this world who are not Muslim; there are Muslims who are not terrorists. Figuring out who is a terrorist, and keeping such people off our airplanes (preferably by killing them, but I digress) is the issue.

The Israelis have shown us how to profile by behavior. Yes, it would be expensive to do something similar in America. But I point out that we spend a lot of money on the TSA today and what we are getting for all that money is an enraged populace.

More in the next comment on what I'd do.
Posted by Steve White 2010-11-22 13:43||   2010-11-22 13:43|| Front Page Top

#63 Private Eye sez: Intimidation and issuing put down is typical gang behavior, especially against outsiders. And being hassled by Ms. Swamp Blondie did nothing to speed along any useful debate.

Hassled? Dear gawd, are you that much of a hothouse plant that you come to the Burg, utter a bunch of things, have people push back at you, and think that you are being 'hassled'?

My respect for you just went down a few notches.
Posted by Steve White 2010-11-22 13:47||   2010-11-22 13:47|| Front Page Top

#64 But many Americans DO want Muslims profiled, in the worst way. I suppose they should be ignored and turned into chew toys, as if expecting your fourth amendment rights not be violated gives you a right to tell me I have to travel with you? Right? How is that freedom again? So separate the two groups out. Yep. It really does suck this much in the United States.
Reread some of your own posters voices that were being drowned out by the noise from Ms. Swamp. And Mr. Gorb was on his way to saying some pretty interesting things when I think he got sidetracked. I was actually looking forward to hearing what he had to say.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 14:09||   2010-11-22 14:09|| Front Page Top

#65 Finally, to Private Eye: what I would do to secure airports.

More visible security presence. Police and security officers are polite, well-groomed, and carry pistols at all times. They eye each and every person who walks into the terminal. They have been trained to find people who don't "fit". In other words, they profile by behavior (not by race, ethnicity or religion).

Some security officers are plainclothes. You and I won't know who they are. They are profiling by behavior as well.

Security officers are at each and every ticket check-in counter and kiosk. They talk with passengers and use the answers to profile.

The officers identify quietly those passengers who need further attention, using appropriate comm gear. Those passengers will be handled at the checkpoint.

All luggage is screened at check-in before it goes to a tug-cart for loading on the plane. For international flights, the luggage appears at the gate; passengers MUST identify their luggage again before it's loaded on the plane.

The security checkpoint comes after the ticket check in, like today, but is designed to move people through quickly while giving security officers the opportunity to continue to profile.

All hand luggage is screened at the security checkpoint. To make that easier, passengers no longer carry big bags through. The rolling luggage that today goes in the overhead bin? That gets checked. That cuts the amount of luggage to be screened at the checkpoint by half. (And airlines learn how to move baggage more quickly upon arrival).

Hand luggage (one or two small bags per passenger) is scanned using current equipment. That is quick. Passengers put metal objects from their pockets into the trays for inspection. That is quick. You have more lines to make this part of the screen quicker.

Passengers do NOT take off shoes and belts. That is demeaning and slows the process substantially. Those are checked by a security officer with a quick hand-wand.

Security officers at the checkpoint profile each and every passenger. They walk up and down the line and ask questions. They inspect ID, tickets, etc. At the head of the line an experienced security person asks questions and inspects documents carefully before the passengers proceed to inspection. They can call up a drivers license or passport number at the terminal in front of them and get a lot information quickly.

(By the way, all security personnel carry secure smart-phones / tablets that let them push information to the central office and get information back).

Passengers who need additional screening are politely taken to another line. That enhanced security line is screened from the public. In that line, luggage is hand-checked carefully. Passengers get a thorough hand-wand check and a non-groping pat down. Bomb-sniffing dogs are nearby if needed. A full body scanner is available (you need only one). All the while, the passengers continue to be profiled with questions. Recognize that 99% of the people who get enhanced security are innocent, so security is polite. You use the data to refine the profiling.

Security is tied into good intel. All overseas and domestic intel about individuals, group threats, etc are being fed to the airport security heads who use that in profiling. A central office in Washington constantly updates the information, but airport security is decentralized and has latitude to use the information as needed. All ticketing information, etc is on hand, and security intel people use that to identify people for more intense screening and profiling at the security checkpoint.

More security is in the gate areas. They continue to profile. They look people in the eye as they board. There is the occasional 'random' screen based on profiling.

Bomb-proof containers are found at the ticket line, security checkpoints and gates. Find a bag that is suspicious? Security personnel are trained to pick that bag up and put it in the bomb-proof, then shut and lock the lid. Then they call for the disposal team. The containers are on wheels, of course, and further handling is done at a secure location nearby. Security at the same time implements a careful, quiet look for the owner of the baggage. Most bags will be innocent, of course, but such a system prevents us from having a panicked evacuation of an entire terminal just for one suspicious bag.

Of course airport employees get a vigorous security review.

All this is done by trained personnel who are paid well and consider the job to be a career path. Many are ex- and retired military. It's a good job for an E5 with 10 years in the Army who now wants to stay home.

That, Private Eye, is how I'd do it. I'm betting I could implement this at O'Hare and not spend that much more money than TSA does now, and I'd move the passengers faster on the Wednesday prior to Thanksgiving than the TSA currently does.

I'll bet that others hear can add to and refine this idea, and point out the flaws that I've missed. I'll let Rantburg U have at it.
Posted by Steve White 2010-11-22 14:18||   2010-11-22 14:18|| Front Page Top

#66 Damn, I haven't gotten that much catty attention since high school. And plenty of the regulars can attest that I haven't even warmed up yet. Sheesh.

No, Private Eye, you don't have to travel with me. I prefer that you don't, actually. I'd pay extra to be on a different flight. Security would have nothing to do with it.

But I do expect the government to respect my rights as outlined in the Constitution. Millions of flights that have reached their destinations without incident prove that it can be done. Capeesh?

And as far as you wishing death on those who disagree with your approved groping, see your own comments in aisle #1 and #4. Technically you didn't wish death on the other passengers, but you came awful damn close to that line.
Posted by Swamp Blondie, notorious hassler 2010-11-22 14:49||   2010-11-22 14:49|| Front Page Top

#67 Umm, yep. I like my vagina grope dealt by the long arm of the law and not by an undertaker finding a piece of it on a runway.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 14:54||   2010-11-22 14:54|| Front Page Top

#68 Only one item to not agree with, Steve, all the rest are 100% good. "The rolling luggage that today goes in the overhead bin? That gets checked." Not doable for those traveling standby...although the luggage will get there, the passenger may not, plus smaller commuter planes put the roll-ons in baggage anyway.
Posted by Muggsy Glink 2010-11-22 14:54||   2010-11-22 14:54|| Front Page Top

#69 Stay classy, Private Eye.
Posted by Swamp Blondie 2010-11-22 14:58||   2010-11-22 14:58|| Front Page Top

#70 Easy.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 15:10||   2010-11-22 15:10|| Front Page Top

#71 Mugsy, in my experience, you can choose at the end of the jetway to check a roll-on. It gets tagged and stays there until boarding is completed, then it gets moved to the hold.

I think one of the biggest holes is the need to add cell phone jammers to the baggage hold. Not all luggage is being scanned by spiral, dual-energy CT yet, and even so, it's hard to tell cheese from explosives.

And even the jammer doesn't handle the cell phone alarm vulnerability.
Posted by KBK 2010-11-22 15:20||   2010-11-22 15:20|| Front Page Top

#72 Like your idea Steve. The only thing I would disagree with is not profiling by religion. I think that religion should be a _factor_ in the screening process. Not the _only_ factor but one of several. A devout muslim is a little more likely to be carrying an explosive than a devout Catholic.

Your observer might, for example, want to examine the muslim who looks nervous while allowing the nervous catholic nun to pass - or allowing the muslim family to pass. If however that nun happens to have a 5-o'clock shadow on her face....
Posted by CrazyFool 2010-11-22 15:42||   2010-11-22 15:42|| Front Page Top

#73 I agree KBK, although Steve was referring to checking the bag at the ticket counter to save the eyeball time later.
Posted by Muggsy Glink 2010-11-22 15:45||   2010-11-22 15:45|| Front Page Top

#74 Muggsy, that's right, that's what I was thinking. I agree the standby factor is an issue.

Lots of things that experienced people in the airline and security industries would have to work out; I just offered one person's opinion.
Posted by Steve White 2010-11-22 15:52||   2010-11-22 15:52|| Front Page Top

#75 The safety of the backscatter scanners is hard to evaluate. Most of what I've seen refers to the whole-body dose, which is small. However, these machines use soft (low energy) x-rays, which don't differ all that much from ultraviolet-C radiation. Much of the energy is dumped in the skin, as it is at the beach. Evaluation as whole-body dose is inappropriate.

The question is, have there been studies performed regarding the frequency of melanoma and basal cell carcinoma in mice induced by the specific spectrum of x-ray employed?

I did a cursory search and came up dry. Most of what I've seen involves appeal to authority. Does anyone have a link to a detailed description of the technology? The website of the original developer's company was no help, their description, like that of the TSA's, is at a grade school level: How does it work? You step into this box, we shine x-rays on you, and then we get this picture.

Or they show a video of someone being scanned.

One hopes the redundant interlocks on the anode voltage are really good. Given the resolution and the speed of the scan, the beam energy density must be pretty high. If the scanning mechanism stops, one could get quite a burn.

Some experts at UCSF sent a letter (pdf) to the administration last spring. The White House replied recently, but I didn't find it very convincing. Nor did the UCSF experts; they are preparing a rebuttal.
Posted by KBK 2010-11-22 15:52||   2010-11-22 15:52|| Front Page Top

#76 Body Scanner Manufacturer's CEO on trip to India with Barack Obama. hat tip Matt Drudge
Posted by wr 2010-11-22 16:07||   2010-11-22 16:07|| Front Page Top

#77 So, do you want to look good for Rantburgers or Gorb? Intimidation and issuing put down is typical gang behavior, especially against outsiders. And being hassled by Ms. Swamp Blondie did nothing to speed along any useful debate.

Private Eye, your comments just don't support each other. They aren't communicating well. They are either offensive, defensive, or distracting from the topic, but never for constructive argument. You are on a blog. Bloggers respond to each other. Figure it out.

There is no intimidation here. It's just that you will find no support here because nobody agrees with you. That's not gang behavior at all. Again, you use the words, but you don't know what they mean. You won't argue about the subject because you lost after your first volley. Maybe you aren't able to admit it.

As for Americans, I am one. And I do not retract the statement about child-adults. Our country is chronologically a baby and acts like one in fits and starts it periodically undergoes.

Yes, I will agree with you that some Americans do seem to act like children.

I would think reading literature like Ulysses would indicate circumspection about one's own nation is not off the menu.

Another insult? How constructive.

And I never said those in the anti TSA plane would die. You put words in my mouth.

No. You don't have to say it. It's the implication of your communication. Whatever other meaning could these words hold that has any value? Am I to believe you put them there just to give your comment some volume?

Is that your science talking now?

Is that an insult? If not, is it supposed to foster communication and constructive argument somehow?

You need to work on your communication skills. You need to work on accepting blunt criticism and not getting offended by it. Do this and you will be light years ahead of where you are now.
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 16:36||   2010-11-22 16:36|| Front Page Top

#78 the TSA should adopt Barry White as its new sound track, you know, turn down the lights a bit, keep everything a little more on the romantic side.....
Posted by 746 2010-11-22 16:47||   2010-11-22 16:47|| Front Page Top

#79 My God. It is amazing. You accuse me of saying that the plane full of pat-down rejecters would die and that I implied that. Actually what I said later in the thread is that we should separate the two groups and do an experiment to see what gets blown up and what doesn't over a five year period. If you put your hand over your heart and say I said you'd die, feel free to. But an admission of fear would be an admission of our government's complicity in not elimating terrorists, so we're stuck with TSA as it is right now. If you fear you'll die, as I do, then you'd want to get back to figuring how to mitigate that threat, not critquing my communication skills. And BTW, whether not a single person here agrees with me, we all have something to offer. And I think KBK, Mugsy and Crazy Fool have said some very constructive criticism of the "don't religious profile" ideology that has got us to where we are.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 16:58||   2010-11-22 16:58|| Front Page Top

#80 To Besoeker, you are one smart cookie. You called it asbsolutely right, in my opinion. Take care.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 17:22||   2010-11-22 17:22|| Front Page Top

#81 My God. It is amazing.

There you go again, all incredulous.

You accuse me of saying that the plane full of pat-down rejecters would die and that I implied that.

Well, yeah. Please reread your posts. And no sneaky peeking into the future as the thread unfolds.

And especially, carefully re-view your comment #1. Consider your use of pronouns. Consider the stereotypes called upon. The contrasts made. The tone and attitude.

And which line you put yourself in.

Actually what I said later in the thread

My point exactly.

In any case, our points have been made and your position seems to align with something that makes way more sense to me than when we started.

I commented myself a few days ago that I would like to see what would happen to the TSAs business if a competing system with a resonable measure of security existed.

Much like you.
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 17:27||   2010-11-22 17:27|| Front Page Top

#82 http://www.cafepress.com/FlyingSoon
Posted by newc 2010-11-22 18:13||   2010-11-22 18:13|| Front Page Top

#83 I commented myself a few days ago that I would like to see what would happen to the TSAs business if a competing system with a reasonable measure of security existed.

I, too, would like to see a competing system. Because this http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2010/11/tsa-training/ is what is the last line of defense against you know what. And it ain't much.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 18:13||   2010-11-22 18:13|| Front Page Top

#84 So, are we going to ultrasound all the preggers to assure that's actually a fetus in there?

If someone is willing to die to kill you, it's pretty hard to stop. There will be planes lost, and other things, too. So what? We lose 40,000 a year to auto accidents and 100,000 to medical mistakes. Yet, we accept the risk. TSA can't guarantee zero risk, yet the basic nature of their bureaucracy is CYA. They will continue to escalate until stopped. Now they are saying they are being abused and want compliance without complaint under penalty of law.

I say, get rid of the TSA entirely, before they unionize, and start over with Steve White's recommendation.

Give the Tangos the aardvark treatment. This approach - profile and challenge - was posted ten days after 9/11 and was well known at that time.

The TSA has gone off into the weeds and isn't fixable.
Posted by KBK 2010-11-22 18:15||   2010-11-22 18:15|| Front Page Top

#85 This Aardvark approach - profile and challenge


Darn, that looks fun.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 18:22||   2010-11-22 18:22|| Front Page Top

#86 Obama: "We Can Absorb a Terrorist Attack"

S
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 18:25||   2010-11-22 18:25|| Front Page Top

#87 How could you not trust a companys data with a President named Deepak Chopra?

http://publicintelligence.net/body-scanner-manufacturer-accompanies-obama-on-trip-to-india/
Posted by Muggsy Glink 2010-11-22 19:31||   2010-11-22 19:31|| Front Page Top

#88 Private Eye - you haven't impressed me today, in fact, I thought better before. Nice job
Posted by Frank G 2010-11-22 20:57||   2010-11-22 20:57|| Front Page Top

#89 I have already told you. I don't say anything to impress this crowd. But I suppose my freedom of speech is the part of the Constitution you want disregarded?
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 20:59||   2010-11-22 20:59|| Front Page Top

#90 no, everyone has a perfect right to be a dick in public speech.
Posted by Frank G 2010-11-22 21:01||   2010-11-22 21:01|| Front Page Top

#91 Indeed. I do think that the Aarvard idea is the best one I have seen all day. Honestly. And I practice radical honesty. I love this country. And I gave my opinions, and they were my original thoughts. Like or dislike, makes no difference to me.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 21:04||   2010-11-22 21:04|| Front Page Top

#92 Like or dislike, makes no difference to me.

obviously it does, or you wouldn't try to defend your bilge for 90 comments.
Posted by Frank G 2010-11-22 21:32||   2010-11-22 21:32|| Front Page Top

#93 When you start invoking the First Amendment on a website that is not yours you've pretty much lost your argument.
Posted by European Conservative 2010-11-22 21:38||   2010-11-22 21:38|| Front Page Top

#94 that is a laugh. Not one person has swung the conversation back around to how to stop playing into the hands of the theatrical muslim suicide bombers besides like CF, Besoeker,and the Aardvark idea which was brilliant and a few others that pointed out that all arguments should be filtered in the context of the religion of the attackers. Someone pointed out that we need to PROFILE MUSLIMS. And then Dr. Steve said went through the proper pc rant about not profiling, stepping up AP security, baggage handling, and that went dead. My bilge is me just arguing a point, any point, while nobody says anything of value that runs counter to Dr. Steve for more than a few sentences. Good job. You really prove you won't express anything that might run counter to the blog owner's views for long without it dwindling out. This blog is not useful.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 22:00||   2010-11-22 22:00|| Front Page Top

#95 I self ban. Don't waste your time bitching about me. Its a waste of time.
Posted by Private Eye 2010-11-22 22:01||   2010-11-22 22:01|| Front Page Top

#96 Oh the drama.

How is it that there are no problems in Ben Gurion airport, but Boston Logan is a problem?

Learn from what works, shitcan the rest.

Obama is right, we can absorb another terrorist attack. Not that we ought, but neither should we be groping people. It is not worth it. Statistically, as many people will die from scanning x-ray induced cancer as would die from plane crashes. More will die from driving instead of flying.

153,000 people die every day. Let's not obsess over how it happens.
Posted by rammer 2010-11-22 22:17||   2010-11-22 22:17|| Front Page Top

#97 It appears Guy Noir, Private Eye, has been searching for the answers to life's persistent questions based out of his office on the 12th floor of the Acme Building. And so he returns not the wiser.
Posted by Muggsy Glink 2010-11-22 22:28||   2010-11-22 22:28|| Front Page Top

#98 You really prove you won't express anything that might run counter to the blog owner's views for long without it dwindling out.

You're not from around here, are you? :-)

This blog is not useful.

Not if you're being a butthead about things.
Posted by gorb 2010-11-22 22:32||   2010-11-22 22:32|| Front Page Top

#99 You really prove you won't express anything that might run counter to the blog owner's views for long without it dwindling out.

Fred hasn't officially posted on this thread....just sayin'.
Posted by Swamp Blondie 2010-11-22 22:45||   2010-11-22 22:45|| Front Page Top

#100 TSA delenda est.
Posted by Bunyip 2010-11-22 22:49||   2010-11-22 22:49|| Front Page Top

#101 Can I come out of my room yet, Swampy? I'll be good...I'll be good!
Posted by Muggsy Glink 2010-11-22 23:02||   2010-11-22 23:02|| Front Page Top

23:02 Muggsy Glink
22:49 Bunyip
22:49 gorb
22:45 tu3031
22:45 Swamp Blondie
22:39 JosephMendiola
22:33 JosephMendiola
22:32 gorb
22:28 Muggsy Glink
22:28 JosephMendiola
22:23 JosephMendiola
22:23 Grunter
22:17 rammer
22:01 Private Eye
22:00 Private Eye
21:59 JosephMendiola
21:58 Broadhead6
21:38 European Conservative
21:32 Frank G
21:17 Private Eye
21:10 Pappy
21:09 Thing From Snowy Mountain
21:05 tu3031
21:05 Frank G
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