Article

2009-06-18

What is "Civil, Well-Reasoned Discourse"?

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Posted by trailing wife 2009-06-18 00:00|| E-Mail|| Front Page|| [11131 views ] Top

#1 TW. And all the mods.
Why Rantburg is a class act.
I'm proud to mostly lurk.
I'll shuddup now.

Posted by Gabby 2009-06-18 00:48|| 2009-06-18 00:48|| Front Page Top

#2 Now I'm scared....I've never seen Trailing Wife use her cluebat, so far her wit has been more than sufficient to slice up any that dare cause her grief.

Since we don't know her cluebat's rating in megatons, I suggest all the bad people hang out somewhere far far away from me. I don't want to end up coated in long-pig flavored soot.

*tips his hat to TW, then gallantly finds a nice quiet hole, where it's dark and safe to lurk in.*

Posted by Silentbrick">Silentbrick 2009-06-18 02:12|| 2009-06-18 02:12|| Front Page Top

#3 People still won't get it. I moderate on another site and no matter how clearly you put it, some mouth breathing dolt is always crossing the line. I'm just glad I can vent a little here at Rantburg. Cheaper than therapy, I'll tell ya. ;)

That reminds me, time to hit the tipjar.

Posted by DarthVader 2009-06-18 07:56|| 2009-06-18 07:56|| Front Page Top

#4 Leonard: Just thought I'd ring you up and see how your new "help desk" job is coming.

Richard: Quite well thank you, but it would be going a damn site better if it were not for these pesky people and their incoming calls!

Posted by Besoeker 2009-06-18 09:10|| 2009-06-18 09:10|| Front Page Top

#5 Cute, Besoeker. And oh, so true! Sadly, it's end users like me who drive them to that attitude. My apologies to all the Help Desk men and women I drove to quiet gibbering over the years.

Silentbrick, Gabby, y'all are two of the many delightful people here at Rantburg who have a high probability of never being at the receiving end of a Cluebat. I haven't seen many banned, or even many needing sinktrapping, relative to the number of interesting, educational, and amusingly snarky posts each day.

DarthVader, Fred provided these tools precisely because some will insist on their inalienable right to break the house rules, forgetting that a) Rantburg is Fred's private property, and he can close it to the rest of us should we annoy him enough, and b) even public spaces have rules and limits on behaviour, eg. you can't use a corner of the public library as your private toilet, or even as a nice open space to practice football cheers.

Posted by trailing wife">trailing wife 2009-06-18 10:03|| 2009-06-18 10:03|| Front Page Top

#6 you can't use a corner of the public library as your private toilet...

Obviously TW, you never been to the downtown branch of the Seattle Public Library. just 4 blocks up from world famous Muskatel Meadows. But I digress...

Having said that. Thanks for all the Mods of all colors (and cluebat megatonnage) for their efforts. You efforts are what makes Rantburg one of the most decent places I've seen.

Posted by CrazyFool 2009-06-18 10:52|| 2009-06-18 10:52|| Front Page Top

#7 I understand all what you say and agree with it, but I still miss Rantburgers like .com. :)

Posted by Willy 2009-06-18 11:00|| 2009-06-18 11:00|| Front Page Top

#8 [funky skunk has been pooplisted.]

Posted by funky skunk 2009-06-18 11:39|| 2009-06-18 11:39|| Front Page Top

#9 Thank you all for the work you do to keep Rantburg a forum for all with a topic or question, snipe hunters, and lurkers who who tire of washing diarrhea of the keyboard out their eyes.

Posted by swksvolFF 2009-06-18 12:15|| 2009-06-18 12:15|| Front Page Top

#10 How about Carter or Fonda? Do we get any kind of exception for them? They may be legal citizens by birth, but they really belong somewhere else, even though they don't seem to be willing to move there themselves.

Would it be OK to wish a painful natural death upon someone?

:-/

Posted by gorb 2009-06-18 13:26|| 2009-06-18 13:26|| Front Page Top

#11 It's one thing to attack people for their personal or political views, and another to call attention to their cerebral failings. Carter and Fonda fall in a category all to themselves. I just like to sit here and dream of all kinds of nasty things to do to people who have no clue to how their views - and frequently actions - harm others. Rantburg is the prime source for my target list. I know I sometimes either come very close to the edge, and occasionally over it, and I've had my hand slapped by several of the mods. I try to remain within reason, but sometimes, I just have to vent. Being banned for a couple of days is serious enough that I hold my tongue in check again until the next extremely stupid event pushes me over the edge again. This being a "cultured barbarian" ain't easy work!

Posted by Old Patriot">Old Patriot 2009-06-18 13:56|| http://oldpatriot.blogspot.com/]">[http://oldpatriot.blogspot.com/] 2009-06-18 13:56|| Front Page Top

#12 Of course the ban on wishing-anyone-ill also does apply to the POTUS (and TOTUS) of which there may be some questions about his citizenship...

Posted by CrazyFool 2009-06-18 13:56|| 2009-06-18 13:56|| Front Page Top

#13 Thanks TW.

Posted by JohnQC 2009-06-18 14:29|| 2009-06-18 14:29|| Front Page Top

#14 Having been on the recieving end of threats of violence against my family and myself by a couple of former frequent posters here because of, for all things, my views on international labor markets, I can only say that I appreciate a little civility.

Let's save our vitriol for those who really deserve it and not eat our own, and what vitriol we have, let's use it wisely where it can have the most effect.

Thanks, TW, and BTW your book is next in queue for my reading pleasure.

Posted by no mo uro 2009-06-18 15:04|| 2009-06-18 15:04|| Front Page Top

#15 Clearly, my next task is to learn how to add a moderator comments, in glorious highlighter colour, to another's post in a thread. But since I'm still climbing the [very high] learning curve, I'll have to do it the old-fashioned way.

It's truly an honour to serve [man] here, JohnQC. ;-) I'm grateful to be given the opportunity by such a wonderful community. no mo uro, happy reading... although I've no memory of what I recommended. Poor, long-suffering TOTUS is not in the no-threats category, CrazyFool, but may yet spontaneously combust from the strain. Old Patriot, I agree some individuals make it very difficult to remain civil, let alone well-reasoned, but you know we only give you a time-out for your own good. You are so much better at it than you used to be, my dear! I've no objection to mocking those who choose to be stupid as they so clearly deserve (eg dear, dear Ms. Fonda and her masculine counterpart, the former president James Earl (Jimmy) Carter -- who I trust is loved by both wife and mother -- or our chew-toy trolls); but, death will come to them soon enough -- there's no need to so much as wish aloud that it be hurried, gorb.

Hopefully funky skunk is using this opportunity to reflect on the error of his ways.

Willy, nobody could turn a phrase, or a couple of vitriolic paragraphs, like .com. But I'll bet if you go back to his best posts you'll find he accomplished that without breaking Fred's rules -- .com was one of nature's gentlemen as well as a gifted writer. I miss him, too. We are woefully diminished by the absence of those who no longer make Rantburg their other home, even as new voices have come to enrich the conversation.

Posted by trailing wife">trailing wife 2009-06-18 15:45|| 2009-06-18 15:45|| Front Page Top

#16 If I may, I will skim over the usual paeans to RB & the mods, straight to the criticism.

I think that the echo has got louder since the banning of certain characters, such as Aris Katsaris. I rarely agreed with anything that he said; although he was good on facts, his opinions & judgements were invariably bad.

Point is, the debate was lively and in depth to the extent that it would seem intimidating to the trolls of the present ilk, who would probably rather watch him be ripped limb from limb by the adults and hopefully learn something (like I did) rather than risk looking like an idiot throwing turds and right-wing-nuttier-than-thou statements into the fray.

In the absence of an effective opposition, the debate becomes more of a snarkfest, with people competing over who can be the snarkiest.

However I do also recognise that, the fact that RB now represents the political opposition does not help, as the wing nuts are likely to get inflamed by the driveby "bitter-clinger-racist" chants from smug Obammunists.

However what you get wrong is still far outweighed by what you get right, so thanks again. My only suggestion would be to actively re-engage on the left. Its the only way to win back power.

Posted by Admiral Allan Ackbar 2009-06-18 16:17|| 2009-06-18 16:17|| Front Page Top

#17

Redacted by moderator. Comments may be redacted for trolling, violation of standards of good manners, or plain stupidity. Please correct the condition that applies and try again. Contents may be viewed in the sinktrap. Further violations may result in banning.

Posted by funky skunk 2009-06-18 16:57|| 2009-06-18 16:57|| Front Page Top

#18 I agree with you to a point, Admiral. I've hated it every time anyone, with the exception of Boris, has been banned, and for precisely the reasons you just gave. If we exclude all argument from the other side we're just chanting, not discussing.

But we have to have rules. Personal attacks are one of the rules. We don't allow them. That's why Aris is banned, not for his opinions, which were subject to debate.

Another rule is calling for people to be killed (other than those wearing turbans and grimacing in our general direction). That includes Jane Fonda and The Worst President Ever. You can hope out loud that they catch gonorrhea and die, but advocating the expenditure of ammunition puts you in the same category the enemy. That's the way they conduct civil, well-reasoned discourse. That's how funky skunk made the pooplist.

Another rule, less well-defined, I think, is trolling, which I define as showing up for the express purpose of firing up flame wars. There have been a few bans I'd not have made, but I'm in kinda sorta objective agreement. Like Zenster.

The other stuff should be obvious to reasonably well-mannered people. We're not racists here, and if you are then go someplace else. This isn't a pörn site. Most of us aren't particularly concerned if you like boys (or girls as inappropriate), though I think most of us are against making it mandatory.

We don't have time for conspiracy theories. B.O.'s obviously got something to hide with regard to his birth certificate, but you can bet your last piaster that there's not going to come an episode where the last election's overturned because it turns out he's actually Indonesian, Kenyan, or Guatamalan. Things don't work that way. Maybe if he's actually an alien from Arcturus, complete with tentacles and eleven eyes...

I don't want to see the site become boring because everybody has the same opinion. At the same time there are some fairly standard standards of good manners, and there are some subjects that cause people to roll their eyes.

Posted by Fred 2009-06-18 17:13|| 2009-06-18 17:13|| Front Page Top

#19 I gotta' tell ya' TW, as a sometime commenter and frequent reader, I have found the "back and forth" between commenters here to be more civil than some sites I read. Having said that, if at any time I have offended anyone by what I've said; it was not intentional and I apologize.
Keep up the good work.

Posted by WolfDog 2009-06-18 17:24|| 2009-06-18 17:24|| Front Page Top

#20 Good to hear from you, Fred!

Hope the hip is doing well. Dancing yet? :-D

Posted by Barbara Skolaut">Barbara Skolaut 2009-06-18 17:50|| 2009-06-18 17:50|| Front Page Top

#21 No. I dislocated it last weekend. I've been in the hospital and laid up since. I'm an unhappy boy.

Posted by Fred 2009-06-18 17:55|| 2009-06-18 17:55|| Front Page Top

#22 I've also turned into a heavy drug user.

Posted by Fred 2009-06-18 17:56|| 2009-06-18 17:56|| Front Page Top

#23 "I've also turned into a heavy drug user."

On the bright side, you probably get some good hallucinations. ;-p

Hope it gets better soon.

Posted by Barbara Skolaut">Barbara Skolaut 2009-06-18 18:03|| 2009-06-18 18:03|| Front Page Top

#24 I've also turned into a heavy drug user.

Hoping for a cabinet position at the WH eh?

Posted by CrazyFool 2009-06-18 18:23|| 2009-06-18 18:23|| Front Page Top

#25 Didja see Patches in there with ya?

Posted by Frank G">Frank G 2009-06-18 18:38|| 2009-06-18 18:38|| Front Page Top

#26 Good to see Fred is back!!! Chocolate and ice cold coke, helps when you come down from the drugs!

Posted by 49 Pan 2009-06-18 22:15|| 2009-06-18 22:15|| Front Page Top

#27 watch out with those drugs, they got Ryan Leaf and Rush.

Posted by 746 2009-06-18 23:05|| 2009-06-18 23:05|| Front Page Top

#28 A Spanish bar is attempting to provide an outlet for uncivil discourse: It's encouraging clients to insult its staff and offering free drinks for original or hilarious abuse..Polish-born bar owner Bernard Mariusz said he thought people needed somewhere to release their frustrations at a time of economic crisis, employing the Spanish language's rich store of earthy obscenities.

"That way they won't let it out on their family," he said.

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2009-06-18 23:39|| 2009-06-18 23:39|| Front Page Top

23:41 SteveS
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23:36 rammer
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22:48 Glenmore
22:37 DMFD
22:15 49 Pan
22:11 Atomic Conspiracy
22:09 49 Pan
21:55 Broadhead6
21:45 tipper
21:33 Rambler in Virginia
21:29 Rambler in Virginia
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